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Chat Area => Archives => Topic started by: Old Meister on February 21, 2008, 07:09:29 PM
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I've realized for a while now that the snake shot is where it's at on Tornados so I've been working on it with some degree of success. But I can't help but think of how things have changed because of this shot. If it was ruled an illegal shot where do you think the game would go? Would it more resemble the old TS days?(at the top level) Just curious,,,
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pull shot all the way...been learning it but not really devoting too much time to it..too much strain on the wrist.....wasnt it at one time illegal in europe...from what i here its not any longer..
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Old Kizer push kicks and wicker back pins
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here we go... k this is my opinion.. so blast me if you must.. but i am not a fan of the roll over.. just seems like a cheap shot.. shooting fish in a barrel if you will. Ive only seen 2 people in my foosings that actually hit a very technical roll over where they come back across the ball with their stroke.. most people ive seen shoot it go over the 365 deg. rotation.. and recoil like they've hit a good shot.. I shoot a pull shot.. I find it more difficult to shoot and or block. It takes time.. practice.. patients and just over all table time to have a great pull.. It took me a day or two to get the roll over simi decent and well i just dont have fun shooting it.. yea it goes it but its like kicking someone in the balls when your in the fight.. just not cool
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Please :'( if you have only seen 2 people shooting a technical rollover stop playing in your basement and go to a real tournament or out on tour. LOL "a day or two to get the rollover decent". I run a local DYP and have played on tour on and off for the last few years (not to mention practicing for multiple hours every week) and having played against top ranked players, and my snake is nowhere near what they can do. Watch Billy P. or Tony S. walk the snake and shoot deadman starting on the far side of the big dot. Something tells me they did not learn that in a week.
"I shoot a pull shot.. I find it more difficult to shoot and or block. It takes time.. practice.. patients and just over all table time to have a great pull.."
Where is the :rolleyes: when you need it? Why would you want to shoot a shot that is more difficult to shoot? That is like saying I'm gonna shoot a two handed backhand in tennis because I'm a purist. Well good luck against anyone who is worth a crap.
Contrary to what you are saying, the snake may be easy to learn, but it is every bit as difficult to master as a pull.
Now I wasn't around at the time but I seem to recall that back in the TS days, the pull shot used to be worth 1/2 pt. because it was so dominant. Everyone whined and complained that it was unfair. So I guess that was like kicking someone in the balls too eh......
BTW over 365 degrees = a spin, when you start the ball in a front pin and contact the ball in less than 365 degrees that is a snake shot.
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usually the people that hate the rollover are the ones who cant block it....I am with thunder on this one...the rollover isnt too teriibly hard to learn the bascis.....but to master it is another story.....I don' t think the pull is harder to learn either.......to me why not shoot the rollover..youve got two deadman options middle and all the inbetweens....lightning quick......gotta have lightning before Thunder
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Ahh yes.. need to get out of my basement.. whew... ive been wondering.. good one.. thats the problem with this stuff you cant say what you think with out someone feeling like they have to come in and be the cool guy.. good for you and all your accomplishments on running dyps and being on tour.. i play in league.. 2 local dyp and 2 brings.. can i not be a fan of the roll over .. is that wrong.. and yes chance i can block a roll over.. thats just not a shot i am a fan of.. some people hate dinks... push kicks and so on.. for me its the roll over
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didnt say you couldn't block the rollover,,,,,just in general people that dislike something is becasue theyve either tried and been unsuccessful, or not willing to try.....Ive heard all the arguments about the snake from even top promasters....but i did say if learnign a shot on TORNADO th erollover is better..... I love the tic tacs and the backpins and the banks.....but I also didnt grow up playing foosball and the only competition i know is on a tornado....the remark wasnt directed at you...you did however say blast me if you must?....
And ive seen thunder shoot a snake....long both ways..and tough to block...
Maybe the snake is shot differently in your neck of the woods, but there are some nasty rollover shooters here in Central Florida...and its not a spin as long as it doesn't travel more than 360 before contact and after contact...
I am all for diverse shots dont get me wrong......Itd be nice if brunswick modified the men Ed has submitted so the other styles of shots would benefit...
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By the way Gravity i appreciate the link you posted to club foos man that is awesome.....How often do they update the master tips...id love to see some more stuff.....
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naw i didnt say that i couldnt.. I mostly play with old school players who shoot pulls and push kicks.. guess i just went a long with them.. yes yes i am guilty for saying blast me.. but im no 2 bit bar hack.. I started that thread.. but Chase Pennell put up the link.. im not too sure when they up date it.. but the wrist for me is finally gettin back to normal..
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Yeah gravity I wasn't trying to be an ass but you did ask to be blasted. I can understand when someone doesn't like a shot but just because something is easy to learn does not mean that it is easy to master. Its not wrong to dislike a shot but you cant turn that dislike into downplaying the skill that a shot requires.
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that i can understand.. i should have been more fourth coming and say that ive only seen 2 players that have actually put in the time to have a decent roll over..
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it is fun to speculate but the Rollover isn't going anywhere any time in our life-time
at this point, you might ask, I wonder what baseball in the US would be like if they didn't use a bat
oh, and as chance said, to be a "spin" a man has to travel more than 360 before and/or more than 360 after striking the ball
I grew up (so to speak) without the Snake and I love all the shots on the table and wish we saw more of them used regularly but alas, people use what works best...so today, there are primarily only 2 shots - the Pull and the Snake (American/Tornado foosball)
more snake than pull (though the gap seems to be shortening a little) and the reason is it is easier to get started (for most people), easier to score early even when it isn't fully developed (generally), and still has a "wow" factor for people who have don't play the game regularly (so if you are out at a bar, you can get friends and onlookers to gasp from the frieghtening speed and overall coolness of the shot)
it ain't goin no wheres any too soon
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Yeah Im with Tuna I love all shots. In pickup I shoot a scorpion as my #1 option with a dink and pushkick as the others. I just shoot the snake when there is $ or pride on the line ;)
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So if there was a "no-snake' tournament you think the winner would shoot a pull? It might be an interesting experiment. Real interesting if there were a lot of old foosers around.
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Yeah most definitely a pull. If you take away the most prevalent shot, everyone will shoot the next best thing. There is a reason why good Tornado players all shoot snakes and pulls.
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It seems the top level is played on the most simplest of game plans. You know, KISS(keep it simple stupid). In watching Terry Moore's match with Johnny Horton it seems a matter of who's game is more basic thus unshakable. Could it be that the way these Tornado tables play that the game loses complexity which makes it less exciting? I was watching some of the matches on another post here on the Bonzini tables and saw a lot more diversity in the shots and couldn't help but feel something is being lost on Tornados.
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As a old schooler you would see euro pins like mine and pulls pull kicks push kicks and the back pinners. The snake is a great shot I am trying to learn it if you cant beat um join them its comeing along with the stroke going back in to the ball its alot less strain to shoot on us old guys we just have to master our 5 row.
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where would we be without the snake???
back in the 1970's
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Nice answer ;)