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Chat Area => Archives => Topic started by: timtebow on May 01, 2009, 07:42:59 AM
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Hello guys!
I am new on this forum! I would really appreciate if you could help me a little.
So... I have played foosball a few times with my friends etc, but just for fun and never really tried to learn anything or get better at it. Next week however I have a pretty important game which I really would like to win. So I am prepared to invest some time and effort in improving my game as much as possible until then. I see there are quite a few talanted players on this forum so I would be really greatful if you could tell me how I learn as much as possible during the few days I have to prepare for the game.
I do not really know the strength of my opponent, but I am assuming he is about as good as me at the moment.
So do you recommend me to do until the game. I have started to look at some tutorials on youtube.com and visited some internet sites. Is there any videos or sites you would recommend specially? Do I learn the most by actually playing foosball or can I also learn something by reading and watching things on the net?
Any help would be greatly appreciated. I will post a summary of how this very important game went once it has been played.
Thanks everybody!
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It would be an understatement to say that teaching you usable and effective skills in such a short amount of time by simply telling you is a stretch. If you both have similar skills then you will do well to have a good defense. This requires you to spread your defensive men about 2 finger widths apart and create a moving target without making the likely target an easy hole to hit. Never let the middle hole just sit in front of the ball but rather make it noticeable but not completely open by moving it from side to side. When you move don't do it with tight muscles, keep them relaxed and flowing. It will help you move to where the ball is going and not over respond. If you tighten up you will find that you will freeze up on shots. You can tease and dare your opponent with this type of defense and make him frustrated which in turn will give you confidence and you then will kick his a--!
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That's a tough question without knowing what level of player you are now.
However, my initial advice is to practice ball control. I only play about twice a month but I've been playing for about 40 years and I still have the same routine when I go out to play. I get a rack of balls and just practice moving the ball from man-to-man and rod-to-rod. The idea is to just get a feel for the table. Ball control and defense will hold you up until you can get going offensively, assuming you're playing someone of equal ability.
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Thanks for the replies guys!
From your comments I have confirmed what I previously thought. I cannot learn by just reading and watching, I need to actually practice as well. I have therefore decided that I will buy an already used/second hand table tomorrow. But I still do not really have anyone to play against. I will still be able to learn eventhough I have no opponent right?
But there must still be some good videos/texts around which I can watch/read to perhaps pick up some good techniques?
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One week is not much time to get ready. Ball control is something you can practice by yourself. If you watch some of the videos on ball control, they'll probably overwhelm you. Just take it slow. But, again I'm assuming you're a fairly inexperienced player. Of course, just the idea that your using a TS avatar tells me you've at least been exposed to the game.
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Of course, just the idea that your using a TS avatar tells me you've at least been exposed to the game.
Well that doesn't count for much in this case. I just picked one that I liked. I thought this one was appropriate because of the "The Millon Dollar Game" text on it.
My experience comes down to playing for fun with my friends. An occasional game every now and then.
Perhaps I should tell you a bit more about the background to this game I am playing on tuesday next week. I took part in a Champions League quiz sponsored by Heineken/Viasat (Swedish TV channel). I did well enough to qualify for a tiebreaker (this foosball game) and the winner gets an all-expenses-trip to the Champions League final in Rome later this month. So I hope you can understand why I am so anxious to improve my skills. They have also told me that parts of this game will be shown in a 2-3 minute long clip on TV. If I am able I will try to record that and post a link on here if anyone is interested (provided I don't embarrass myself, haha!)
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don't buy a table just for this...where are you playing, can you find time to get to that table? that would be ideal so you get the feel for what you will really be facing
if one of us could spend some time on the table with you it would be much easier to help you with a few basics so we could demonstrate and give you feedback when you try it
but OM has got the right idea on defense...you can practice ball control but in a week you won't get much out of that except maybe to make you a little more comfortable...won't hurt but keep your expectations low
get as much table time as you can and as I said on the table you will play on, or one just like it, if possible
while you are on the table, practice moving your hands from one rod to another to get used to where they are at on the table because you are playing singles and if the other person is a beginner like you, you will be reaching and moving for balls all the time
also, when the other person has the ball on their 5 bar or in goal, keep one hand on your goalie rod as a last ditch effort if a ball is rolling toward the goal and to make them think a little more...this means if they have the ball on their 5 bar you will defend with your right hand - again, as part of your table time and work on moving from rod to rod, even without someone to play, practice doing this and moving your men around and moving your hands from rod to rod so you will be comfortable
if you know someone who will put some table time in with you to help you warm up then it will do much for you to play them as much as possible to work on these things
also, think about what OM said about defense...what he was talking about was defense against the other person when they have the ball on their 3 rod
break the goal into 3 equal parts so you have a general idea that your men can basically cover 2/3 of those holes...avoid 2 things...1st, dont be hyper and try and jump all over the place and race the person to open holes and 2nd don't sit dead still and then jump at any movement the other person throws at you
keep your guys basically in the middle of the goal, as OM said about 2 fingers apart, and bob them about 1 inch either direction, in and out, as random as possible...some movement, not hyper, home base is the middle of the goal
what you want to do is make it hard for the other person to see a good big hole, keep from creating big holes by jumping too much, and make them shoot a perfect or totally lucky shot to score
now, if he is a "scrub" (no offense) like you, then he won't have the ball on his 3 row trying to do much of anything it will be wacking at the rolling ball mostly and that goes back to be comfortable moving from rod to rod
the only exception to the 3 rod D I am talking about is if the have the ball on the outside men (close to the near or outside walls) in this case, you will want to use the same defense we talked about except you want to move it about 2 inchs toward the side he has the ball making the short side harder to see and hit
you will want to keep your guys in what is called a standard formation - you can see what this looks like in the link here http://www.discoverahobby.com/learnfoosball.htm
I am looking for some other diagrams that I thought I could find but not so far...I will find them and if they are helpful as I think they will be, I will add in another post
questions so far?
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Thanks for a long and good post bbtuna!
don't buy a table just for this...where are you playing, can you find time to get to that table? that would be ideal so you get the feel for what you will really be facing
if one of us could spend some time on the table with you it would be much easier to help you with a few basics so we could demonstrate and give you feedback when you try it
I live in Sweden and I will play this match on tuesday in Stockholm (the capital city) so playing anyone from here is probably not an option. The table I am buying is an already used table (according to the seller it is still in almost new condition though), but I am buying it at a price equivalent to about 100 USD and since the prize I can win is estimated to be worth around 3000 USD I see this as a small and worthwile investment. Furthermore I have the option to resell it also and make most of my 100 USD back if I don't feel like I want it after the game. I will not be able to play on the table the match will be played on and I don't know what it looks like. How big of a difference is there between the different types of tables?
It seems like defense is the easiest thing to learn quickly, and I also feel I have some idea of how it works from previous experience and the help of you guys.
keep your guys basically in the middle of the goal, as OM said about 2 fingers apart, and bob them about 1 inch either direction, in and out, as random as possible...some movement, not hyper, home base is the middle of the goal
Ok, so not too many quick and reflex moves, mostly controlled and well thought through? By "your guys" which guys do you mean? The goalie and the "defenders"? Or all of my players?
As for attacking I have seen there are a couple of different types of shot that you guys talk about, i.e. "snake shot". Should I try to learn myself these shots? Focus on learning 1 of them, if so which one? Or focus on other things and try to score "normally"?
And thanks for the link, I'll check it out now!
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The "Foosball University" section on here seems pretty good. Is it worth learning?
http://www.foosball.com/content.php?page=3
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yea, but probably not so much considering your short window...don't want to overload on information so that none of it is useful...you want to concentrate on a few basics, your chances are best that way
i am thinking about offense for you, which hasn't been mentioned yet, considering the time and distance...I will be back in touch
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Okay...I have been through tons of these matches and here is my humble advice.
When you are serving the ball, it will start on the middle rod (5 bar). Try to hit the ball toward their goal when the ball is in front of the goal as hard as you can. Might be easier right handed if that is what you are. You might have to wait a second or so until their man is not in front of the ball.
For the 3 rod and 2 rod on offense, you should try to stop the ball and execute a shot, but that might not be possible and I would try the same approach. Move the ball and shot it hard at their goal as soon as their player is not in front of the ball. Practicing pushing and pulling the ball and catching the ball would be somewhat important. Since you are unsure as to what table the game is on, I really wouldn't worry too much about passing or ball control. For instance it could be played on a table with a ball that does not roll straight.
For defense stay in front of the ball...fakes and a lot of movement will hurt you as they are probably going to just wack at the ball and will score a lot if you are not in front of the ball (between the ball and the goal)
So...stay in front of the ball on defense and on offense shoot it as hard as you can at the goal when they are not in front of the ball. And practice pushs and pulls and hitting it hard where you want it to go. To do this from in back put up all the men and fire away (use the videos to get an idea of grip and stance).
Good Luck,
John
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good advice especially on the 5 bar...
you should know and have some basic rules handy...first is, you start the game after a coin flip and the winner gets to serve...after that, you get to serve the ball after each time the other player scores
learn to drop the ball so that it rolls to your 5 bar...this is legal and is something you can FOR SURE learn in a week
after that, do as John said and hit the ball as hard as possible toward the goal...of course, try and do it when the other persons 5 is not in the way...this may backfire once in a while but it will be much more in your favor than not
you probably don't know what a "push" and "pull" are do you? these require you get control of the ball on your 2 or front 3 rod and then "do" a shot
based on what you have said, I think you will be lucky if you can stop and control the ball at all let alone shoot...if you can, all the better
yea, always shoot when a guy isn't infront of the ball but if they seem to follow the ball real well and you can't seem to get that open hole, hit the edge of the ball, one side or the other, mix it up, as hard as you can
in the mean time, I was debating trying to teach you how to hit the ball real hard with the shortest window possible
you want to do a "palm roll" - grip the rod like a handshake, lift your thumb, and push your hand down letting the handle "roll" up your palm a bit, and then pull up hard and catch the handle in your fingers
never tired to explain that writing before...I will see if I can find a video...it is much easier than it sounds and nothing will allow you to hit a ball harder (even for top level players)...start with the ball in a stationary position, and practice whacking it forward (lift all men on the table and practice with your 2 bar first)...just line it up and try and hit it as hard as possible straight and then on the edges of the ball
then, when you start to get a little comfortable with that, start 3 or 4 inches away on one side of the ball or other, still sitting the ball still (direct under rod) and then move the man over and do the plam roll at the same time and whack the ball
learn to do this from either side of the ball
you can do this in a week and get to hit the ball pretty hard - this will be very helpful making an offense on short notice
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I don't have alot of time to elaborate, but I'm sure someone here will. Or they will just tell you to ignore me ;)
If the ball isn't very controllable (sits still, roll fairly straight when moving slowly), then kickshots might be the best course of action. They are also pretty easy to learn. AND, if the kickshots are done with the palmroll, they generate some slop goal opportunity as well.
Another key thing is making sure you keep the men on your goalie rod, and your 2-man rod down at all times (even when you don't have the ball in your goalie area). Also try to leave the goalie man and one of the 2-man men in front of the goal, even if you are playing on the front rods.
Simple things to help keep the slop goals from going against you too much.
Good Luck!!
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do you know what a "kick" shot is?
how many games are you playing or is it just one game and how many points are you calling a game?
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ah ha, video on the palm roll
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cmz5BGw4W_w
it isn't long but you can watch it as many times as you need and it gives you the basic idea...the higher up you roll it, the closer to your wrist, the more downward motion you can create and thus more power
downside of this is it takes long and more motion for people to follow...I am just telling you so you have the concept down and you should do whatever you can get comfortable with... the harder you pull up after the upward plam roll, the harder the shot will be
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oh, and you want to play fun and free without thinking about anything being "on the line"...just play each ball as fun and as hard as you can and let the chips fall where they may
the more you make of winning and losing, the more it will distract you from the "goal" at hand
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Thanks for all the replies! Really you are helping me out a lot more than I could ever imagine! Really really great!
No, I don't really know what "push", "pull" are. But I am assuming push means pushing the ball with your player and pull means pulling the ball with your player. The "kick shot" is the most common shot for beginners I would assume. Just moving your player about 90 degrees backwards and shooting?
I do not know anything else about the table or rules apart from the fact that they have said that I should expect it to take maximum 2 hours. But that includes some extra time to shoot something for TV I would think..
But I am pretty sure the table will be in a very nice condition and the ball will roll straight etc. I have understood that "spinning" is not allowed in normal rules, but I don't know what rules will apply for this game. So if it is allowed would you recommend me to use spinning? Is there any special way in which to defend "spinning"?
EDIT: thanks for the video. Videos showing how to actually grip the stick and so on seems a little bit more helpful. And yes of course it would be great if I could try to forget about what is at stake. But not sure I can do that, but I'll do my best. :)
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If you have a week to practice and access to a table, I would definitely try to learn a simple push kick and pull kick. Very basic shots, but easy to learn and execute well enough against a beginner. Should be able to score lots of points against someone who is inexperienced at defense. I taught my wife (a non-player) in an hour a basic push kick and pull kick and she can still score on me because her timing is so unpredictable. I suspect you wil similarly frustrate your opponent.
Here is a video of a push kick:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnlI_nOXq4k&feature=related
Here is a video of a pull and push kick - the video is a little more advanced than you need, but you get the general idea:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWpOYRxVEGw
Otherwise, the tips on here are all pretty spot on - these guys are experts.
Also, I would not resort to spinning except as a last resort -no control and relying purely on luck.
Good luck.
ClearScreen
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Timetebow, I take it you are a fresh beginner. So your first shot should be to hit the ball from a side player to the middle player and hit it in. Otherwise smack it in when ever you can! Bang bang bang! go for it on steroids! When he gets the ball do like I said but otherwise BANG
IT!
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I am not trying to spam...
Go to www.mindsetfoosball.com "Click on the Forum" and look for "ProMaster Advice" for some hardcore tips...YouTube has tons of small clips and Matches of ProMasters
Search: "Learn to play Foosball" "Tony Spredeman" "Billy Pappas" There is also a guy on there that has some great vids "Zeke" those are a good start! you can see how top players play the game! and that will help you know how to play a controlled game
IF: You have time to practice on a table dont worry about shooting or defence. Work on ball control!!! Ball control is the key to this game...Move the ball around and figure out how to control the ball if you can do that you can control the game and take the risk out of losing... This would be one of the best things you can do! what good is it if you cant move the ball around...know what i mean?
-Things to work on if you have this time-
#1, Tic-Tac the ball around (Between as many men as you can)#
#2, Pin the ball and move it around (Start with the closest man to you and work it to the next man and then the next man....) Do this from a front pin and back pin...
Then you can start working on shots....
This is the best way to learn quickly!
Chase
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i don't want to be contrary but because you have only a week, I really don't recommend you taking the approach Chase is talking about...I am 100% in that "Ball Control" is THE essential ellement to getting good but it takes time and layers and you only have a week
I also recommend staying away from the Pro Master tips for now so you don't get your head too full of stuff you can't apply or use
I am trying to keep this simple assuming you don't know anything and assuming the person you will play doesn't either KISS...Keep It Simple Sam
only so much you can do in a week, lets make the most out of it we can
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Hi guys, thanks for all the new replies.
I have now bought my table. This is what it looks like:
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/4999/dsc04300w.jpg
It feels a little small and the ball doesn't roll straight at all times. I imagine the table I will play the game on will be top notch. Is there a big difference?
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one week ha i would say all of the above starting with ball control then plan a shot make it your shot . get some time on a table with someone with a little experiance not only for tips but to pratice your defence good luck
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Since you from Sweden I am gonna assume you are going to be playing on a Garlando or possibly TecBall??? Anyways, the table probably isnt going to make much of a difference. I think you will have plenty of time to be able to work on your ball control and shooting. Checking out the pic of your table, ball control practice is gonna be hard... and I am sure that if you shoot on that thing enough times the rods are going to bend like tin foil.
The advice I have for your match is to make sure that you have 2 of your defenders in front of your goal at ALL times and make sure that they arent directly in front of each other... spread them out just alittle over a ball width apart. Alot of times beginners totally forget about where their back guys are... also I would put directly in the middle of the goal when the other guy has the ball in the back... chances are he isnt going to be able to pick out holes.
As far as practice goes. At the start of any practice session just thow the ball in and work on hitting it in between every guy. I agree with Chase on that if you can control the ball, the game will be alot easier for you and you will not turn the ball over as much as the other guy. Just work on this for about a half an hour to an hour. Doing this everyday you will have gained enough skill to be able to control the ball.
When you practice shooting, NEVER place the ball where you want it with your hand. Always set your shot up as if you are in a match. That is where the ball control skills come into play. Not knowing how long you have been playing, I probably suggest a simple pull kick. It is a shot that alot of beginners use cause they can hit the ball harder than a push kick and more times than not it is more comfortable to shoot. Basically just practice what you see in that youtube video, and make sure you use all of your options with that shot in the match.
If you get the ball on your 5bar, hit the crap out of it and try and hit it towards the goal. Thats what I do when I play... :)
Have fun and good luck! Need any more tips let us know...
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awesome practice table, this will be perfect...the garlando and tecball have ball control issues in comparison with what most of us play on here Tornado, Warrior and even bozoni(sp?) are tables where you have and can control the ball with ease (with practice of course).
Your pactice table will show you how hard this can be and cut shots will work good on this table. Where you hit it at an angle by hiting at the side of the ball, also called a chip.
You got ramps and either table you play on should have ramps as well.
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Hey guys! I guess I should post an update on how it is going!
So... as I said I bought a table (http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/4999/dsc04300w.jpg) yesterday. It certainly isn't of the best quality, I am assuming it ranks among the worst tables around.. hehe. Anyway I didn't want to spend too much money just for this game, especially since I don't have too much time to work with (the game is on this tuesday).
What I have done is read and watch all the material you guys have given me and tried some stuff out. I have played some on my own and a lot against my 7 year old smaller sister (luckily I am beating her comfortably at least, haha!) Tomorrow I am planning to play some games at my University against friends of mine. They have a better table there..
Ball control is very hard on the table I have as someone already pointed out (or maybe is it that I just suck terribly much, hehe). But I have tried to pass the ball between the players on the 3-rod but it doesn't work very well and I don't think I will be able to work it out in time for Tuesday. My shot is pretty powerful, but its hard to do some special shoots. I have tried to work some on my pull shot and I have made some progress imo, but then again it is tough on this kind of table.. Defence is kinda hard to practice against a 7 year old, lol. But I hope to get some tougher opponents tomorrow at my university. :)
Btw, someone mentioned that I should learn how to make sure the ball goes to my own 5-rod and not the opponents when I "serve" after a goal has been scored. I have tried some stuff, but I haven't yet figured out how I can make sure of this. Help?
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Ok, now it's just 1 day left until the game. Today I got some more information about the game. It will be played on a table looking just like this one:
http://www.spelbord.se/products/4-1super.jpg
The game will end whenever someone has scored 3 goals (!!). That is not a very long game I would imagine.
I don't know how well you can see the tables from the pictures I have, but do you think it is a big difference between the two tables? (mine and the one the game is played on)
I'm starting to get nervous now..
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Oh, one more question. Someone once told me to always keep one hand on the goalie-rod, would you guys also recommend this? Like if my opponent has the ball on his goalie-rod should I have my hands on the 3-rod and the goalie-rod?
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Well...I have played on this table and yes ball control is really hard. What I did was very short pulls from in back so I didn't have to move the ball much as I would lose it. When in my goalie area I would circle the ball with the man and then moved the ball a short distance say about 1/2 inch and then hit toward the hole.
In front I would hit angle shots are straight shots, don't try to move the ball too much as you might lose it.
John
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Well...I have played on this table and yes ball control is really hard. What I did was very short pulls from in back so I didn't have to move the ball much as I would lose it. When in my goalie area I would circle the ball with the man and then moved the ball a short distance say about 1/2 inch and then hit toward the hole.
In front I would hit angle shots are straight shots, don't try to move the ball too much as you might lose it.
John
Thanks for the advice!
Just to make sure, you are talking about this: http://www.spelbord.se/products/4-1super.jpg table right? And not the one I mentioned earlier in the thread..
BTW, how does a game restart (i.e. start after a goal has been scored) on a table like this one? I cannot see any holes in the sides in which to drop the ball..
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Yeah it was that table...
The tournament director will let you know how to serve...some like to just drop the ball in the table in between the two five bars (middle rods).
And yes keep one hand on the goalie rod, I would almost grab both rods in back when they had the ball as the ball can bounce around like on a pinball machine.
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THANK YOU ALL!!!
I won my game, the final score was 3-1. It all was over very quickly, in about 2 minutes. I don't remember too much about the game actually, just that I scored 1-0, my opponent 1-1 and then 2-1, 3-1.
I am very greatful for all the help I have gotten from this board. To be honest though I think it was mostly a mental help more than an actual improvement in skill.
My opponent was a 50 year old guy who hadn't played foosball in about 30 years (I am a 21 year old..) So I guess the odds were on my side pregame...
I am so happy and once again thanks everyone!
I will be watching the Champions League Final in Rome later this month from the VIP section... :D :D :D
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Way to go!
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Congratulations timetebow!! The newest Champion amongst us!!
Pat Ryan
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Congrats, do you remember what shots you hit to score?
Enjoy the match.
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Congrats, do you remember what shots you hit to score?
Enjoy the match.
thx every1!
I will get a dvd of the bit shown on swedish tv. I'll try to upload that on the internet and share with you guys. ;)
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timtebow
Are you interested in hooking up with some of the organized players in Europe? If you get the bug, let us know. It would be nice if your latest adventure got you interested in taking the plunge.