Topic: Remove a rusty screw from a Handle

[kinso]

Hello,

I have a recently bought a Bonzini, and I would like to give it a clean.
I have 2 handles where the screw are completely rusty and the head of the screw completely altered



Does anybody has an advice on how I could remove them? I think I need to drill, but not sure if it is the right method and I am afraid to alter the bar.
Thanks
Nico

[man caveman]

I think your right about drilling. As an electrician I have to take apart a lot of lights ect that have been out in the elements. I don't have time to soak it in oil so I center punch the head then drill with a bit the size of the bolt or screw not the head . then you could pull off the handle. At that point you might try soaking it in oil to remove the shank of the screw with vise grips or pliers.if there is enough left to get a grip on.

[kgstewar]

Remember, those screws have left-hand threads, so turn clockwise to loosen them. (if you've already removed the other screws, you probably know this already). I'd soak them with WD-40 for a day and then try again with a screwdriver before drilling. One benefit of drilling is that the clockwise motion of the drill bit will tend to loosen the screw.

Congratulations on purchasing a Bonzini. They are awesome tables. Would love to see some pics of the whole table!

[Alan Cribbs]

Turn your handles in completely clockwise. It will relieve any pressure placed on the backside of the screw. Then try to unscrew by going clockwise with your screwdriver.
If you are able to get the screws out, I would suggest never putting them back in. They are just for theft prevention. Torque is the only force that keeps the handles tightened.
If you need parts just give me a call. I love refurbing old tables and  Mr. kgstewar is a master.



AC

[kinso]

Thanks for your reply.
The head of the screw is really impossible to use, so I do need to drill
I did try to drill, but I think my driller is not powerful enough. I took some steel drill, and didn't really manage to get much. I will try with a bigger one and maybe rent a more powerful driller...
I do agree I won't put the screw back...as I trust my friends

As a last and extreme solution, if I cannot manage to drill, I was thinking of breaking the handle in order to free the screw, I was thinking about trying to saw the beginning of the head to reach the head of the screw.
I know drilling is probably the best solution, but if I am not able to do it do you think it is a possible solution? Does the handle break easily once you started to crack it?
I rather prefer buying a new handle than a new bar!

I will post some pict of the table as soon as I finish, here is one I have, the quality is pretty bad but you get the idea I quite like the edition!


Are you based in uk guys or in US?

[Alan Cribbs]

I'm in the U.S.
And you?


Alan

[kinso]

I live in London
Nico

[kgstewar]

You'll need a good drill bit (cobalt or titanium) and as Man Caveman suggested, center punch the screw head and the drill bit diameter should be slightly less than the diameter of the screw shaft. Any 18V cordless or corded drill should work. Since these are left-handed screws, regular right-handed twist drill bits should work. I like Alan's suggestion of first screwing the handle on tight so that it relieves some pressure off the back of the screw head. If you're lucky, the screw will start to spin out before you drill all the way through.

If the drilling doesn't work, you certainly can try cutting off the handle, and new handles are available. I see you are in London, but let me put in a plug for Alan Cribbs at bonziniusa.com for the USA readers. He has an enormous amount of expertise, which he shares freely, and has every part for Bonzini, even my ancient B60. Excellent prices and outstanding customer service, too!

Great looking table! Do you know the year it was built?

Kevin

[kinso]

Hey Guys,

Thanks for all your advices.
I finally managed to remove these screw by drilling then forcing with the handle to break the head of the screw. It unfortunately has broken but it is fine as I don't plan to put back these screw, so all good!!

I have been pulling apart everything tonight and it is pretty dirty but I this globally everything is in a very good shape, just need a bit of cleaning.
I will post some pictures to ask for advice on how to clean certain part.

I bought a barrel rifle cleaner for the bar.
The only thing I am not sure about is to remove the player as I don't have a template to reposition them properly after. How do you do usually?

I will list all the pieces I want to replace and may be contact you Alan.
I saw this doc on Bonzini USA
http://www.bonziniusa.com/foosball_sales/Table%20Maintenance/Table%20parts-complete.pdf

Which is awesome to list exactly what I want

Kevin, the table is from 1983 if I have good memory

[kgstewar]

Glad you were able to pop off the handles! I refurbished a 1972 B60 and you can see my trials and errors in this thread:

http://foosball.com/forum/index.php?topic=5058.0

Might be useful as you begin your work. As far as spacing the players, I used these numbers, which I think I got from the Bonzini website somewhere.

Center-to-center player spacing
- 5-man bar: 125 mm
- 3-man bar: 200 mm
- 2-man bar: 285 mm
On each bar, the first player is situated approximately 6 mm from the outer edge of the bar, on the conical side.
- Goalkeeper: centered on the goal

EDIT: Found the link on the Bonzini site:
http://www.bonzini.com/en/football-table/Products/FAQ-Maintenance/

Kevin

[kinso]

Woaw, Now this is a proper restauration!!

Unfortunately, I won't be able to do that yet, as I am living in a flat share with no proper workshop.
So I am focusing on the most important at the moment the bar and I will see for the rest when I will have more space and better tools.

But my table is definitely in a better shape as yours originally
Hopefully I will be able to start the cleaning this weekend and see I have any problem

Thanks for your help!
Nico

[kgstewar]

A good cleaning may be all you need. My table was actually quite playable after doing a thorough cleaning, but then I just couldn't leave well enough alone :-)

Please post pics along the way, if you can!

Kevin

[man caveman]

Wow kgstewar that was some project. From what I could see from  kinso's picture at least the men look like they haven't taking too much of a beating.

[kinso]

Hello guys,

Just a quick update on the cleaning of the table (I will call that cleaning rather than restoration, when I see the shape of the other table )
So, so far, so good,
The cabinet is in a very good shape and the field as well as you can see on the picture:



I removed all the bar and the different part and did a proper cleaning for all of them



To be honest, I was surprised how in good shape everything was. I will just need to buy some washer as they broke in part and some little pin but I think that's pretty it

i was hesitating to replace the springs and inner spring, but I think they all are in a good shape, I let you judging if you think the same


I had to remove the little piece of coton/felt inside and need to put new one in. Do you know where I can buy this type of things? Internet? What shall I look for?


An other thing, I would like to have your opinion about, the 2 bars of the defence players are slightly bend, it is not massive, we are talking about 8mm to a 1cm maximum. I saw what you did Kevin do unbend them but I don't have neither the space or the tool to do that (I am living in a flatshare so no proper workshop), may be one day so I was thinking switching the inner bar between the defence and the middle ones. The defence player's bars look slightly bend too, so I don't know if it is a good idea or not... The table would be still playable. Let me know.

Last thing, i hope you are not going to jump off your chair, but I removed the paint at the foot of the players.

And I am going to try to sand down them like the ITSF table.

I don't know if you've experienced this but if I play with the ITSF yellow ball, I don't have any grip at all with my player, the ball slide very easily from the player which make very difficult any control.

The bar where I am playing has ITSF table and the foot of the player have no paint and the side are sand down in order to remove the little bend on the side of the player to increase the control.

I hope this will help to get more grip on the ball. I am a little bit sceptical as I have remove paint from some player before and found it a little bit better but still don't manage to get the same grip like in the bar.

If you had the same experienced and managed to solve it please share

I will now order my part to Bonzini and just reassemble everything! whoop whoop!
Nico

[man caveman]

First of all thanks for putting up pics of your table. It looks nice. I would love to hear other people chime in. I own a European table and had a tough time pinning the original wooden balls. I bought cork 36mm cork balls and they are a lot easier to pin but they wobble around a lot. Of course a good player can adapt but it's tough for average like me.
p.s
I think the ball, table surface material, foot design ect make a big difference on play. I thought about removing the paint from my players feet also.